Fuel pump issue - BMW K1600 Forum : BMW K1600 GT and GTL Forums
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post #1 of 23 Old 07-16-2017, 04:51 AM Thread Starter
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Fuel pump issue

So,

I just bought a 2015 K1600 GT black with only 215 miles from a private party for $13,000 3 days ago Everything on the bike was as new condition. It started right up and seemed ok. I had a long ride home ahead of me from So California to Las Vegas, NV, (*Yes, I live there.) A few miles into the trip the bike would not rev above 3000 RPM. This was very concerning as I thought the worst scenario. I stopped the bike on the pacific coast highway and phoned a local BMW dealer service department and they said it was 99% sure it was the fuel pump and they could have a replacement in next week and be about $1500 total...

Well that just would not do for me so I found a independent service shop and they do a lot of work on the K1600 and yes, he did have the part and could get it done in 2-3 hours time. I limped the bike, (*on gravity feeding the fuel) 16 miles to his shop and they went to work straight away. The had the internal module and as opposed to BMW who would replace the whole pump and internal tank float, filters etc, it only needed the part that spins the fuel.

The reason it was not working is that the original owner had the bike sit in his garage for 1 1/2 years on a battery tender and the ethanol in the fuel damaged the fuel pump. The bike was fixed for a mere $330 and it runs fantastic. The previous owner did not know anything about the impending pump failure but decided to cover the cost of the repair out of a goodwill gesture. I love this bike and it has the premium package with the Garmin 5, etc. I thought I had done my research on the machine and knew about the weeping water pumps, seat issues, (Although, I like the seat actually.) but I did not see the fuel pump issue as I am sure there are many post about this topic. Lesson learned.

The bike runs and works perfect.


PS: Check out my "Garage" here.





Sky

Last edited by Skyguyz; 07-16-2017 at 02:25 PM.
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post #2 of 23 Old 07-16-2017, 05:49 AM
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Glad you got fixed up, but you should know: your bike is still under warranty (less that 3 years old and less than 36,000 miles) so your repair would have been done for free if you brought it to a BMW dealer; 2. no reputable BMW dealer would have replaced anything but the fuel pump if only the fuel pump was damaged; 3. Replacement of a fuel pump on. K1600 by a BMW dealer would not have cost $1,500; nor would a dealer have quoted a price for the repair on a bike under warranty that the dealer had not even seen; 4. usually, a BMW dealer who doesn't have a part like a fuel pump in stock can have the part overnight; 5. most, if not all BMW dealers would not diagnose a problem like yours over the phone. As a bad fuel pump is not a common problem with K1600s, any number of things could have been the cause of your problem from a clogged fuel filter to a leak in the system, to bad gas (much more likely than a bad fuel pump) to malfunctioning coils, to any of those bad things that you were thinking when you were thinking the worst; 6. that a non BMW dealer had the fuel pump to your bike in stock makes you a very lucky buckaroo. It's unlikely that even a BMW dealer would have the part on the shelf. 7. There is no way for anyone but a lab that can disassemble your pump and conduct sophisticated tests on its various parts to know that your pump failed because of ethanol in the gas. 8. It is highly unlikely in any case that your fuel pump would have failed due to ethanol in the gas as there are no parts in it that would have been affected by ethanol. So, please forgive me if I am wrong; but somehow, I'm not buying your story; or as is sometimes said on this forum: I'm calling BS.
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post #3 of 23 Old 07-16-2017, 10:04 AM
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There was a fuel pump recall.

You are home and you have a good dealer off 215 that can look everything over. To make sure all recalls and updates are done. To make sure everything is as it should be. $330 to get home was affordable.
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post #4 of 23 Old 07-16-2017, 10:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RL Lemke View Post
There was a fuel pump recall.
Not on the 2015's. Problem fixed by then.
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post #5 of 23 Old 07-16-2017, 10:11 AM
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Originally Posted by GTLen View Post
Not on the 2015's. Problem fixed by then.
That's good.

Probably a $330 cashectomy for a bottle of Techron.
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post #6 of 23 Old 07-16-2017, 10:22 AM
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Most likely.
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post #7 of 23 Old 07-16-2017, 11:13 AM
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2015 GT low mileage loaded for $ 13000 is a steal.................
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post #8 of 23 Old 07-16-2017, 11:45 AM
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I am a service manager of a heavy equipment company. I get people all the time calling in asking me to trouble shoot the problems over the phone. Very tuff to do when you don't know the whole story. It could be this or it could be that. Sorry we won't know for sure until someone looks at it. Second the bike is under warranty why not have BMW dealer look at it first? Maybe it could have been fixed for nothing. Not all dealers of bikes,cars etc are crooks or as some call them stealers.
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post #9 of 23 Old 07-16-2017, 12:41 PM Thread Starter
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GTLen,

Quote:
Glad you got fixed up, but you should know: your bike is still under warranty (less that 3 years old and less than 36,000 miles) so your repair would have been done for free if you brought it to a BMW dealer;
There was no appointments available from any BMW dealer within "Range" when this happened that could look at the bike that day or even within the next few days. Remember, I was not in my home town and leaving the bike and going home was an option that was a disaster in the making. I did not tell the tech what year the bike was and nether did he ask and I am assuming the BMW tech quoted me for a bike that was done recently was not a warranty repair. Yes, at the time I did not consider it a warranty repair. It was a tragic failure and the thought did not occur to me. My only objective was to get it fixed. Yes, it would have been covered in a warranty situation.

Quote:
2. no reputable BMW dealer would have replaced anything but the fuel pump if only the fuel pump was damaged;
To further this point, the BMW tech said this pump came from BMW as a "Unit" and would be replaced as a whole, not just the part that actually failed within the unit.

Quote:
3. Replacement of a fuel pump on. K1600 by a BMW dealer would not have cost $1,500; nor would a dealer have quoted a price for the repair on a bike under warranty that the dealer had not even seen;
When I queried the BMW tech about the problem of course he said it could be a mired of possibilities but he did say "With the symptoms you described it sounds like the fuel pump is inop and that he did one with the same exact symptom last week." I then asked the appx cost associated with this repair, (*I had not yet given him the year of my bike.) He said:"Well I just did this repair and the range could be as much as $1500, but the problem has to be diagnosed." Of course I asked for the "Worst case" scenario considering my predicament.

Quote:
4. usually, a BMW dealer who doesn't have a part like a fuel pump in stock can have the part overnight;
The issue was not if he could get the part but I was limited on the distance I could safely ride the bike in that condition and hence that shop could not "Squeeze me in" until a next week. Yes, my post stated the pump would be "In next week" and I stand corrected that it was the appointment next week, not the pump.

Quote:
5. most, if not all BMW dealers would not diagnose a problem like yours over the phone. As a bad fuel pump is not a common problem with K1600s, any number of things could have been the cause of your problem from a clogged fuel filter to a leak in the system, to bad gas (much more likely than a bad fuel pump) to malfunctioning coils, to any of those bad things that you were thinking when you were thinking the worst;
I did simply ask what the problem could be and as stated above: When I queried the BMW tech about the problem of course he said it could be a mired of possibilities but he did say "With the symptoms you described it sounds like the fuel pump is inop" and that he did one with the same exact symptom last week Now it was me that pressed him for a "Off the record" diagnose considering my predicament and he obliged knowing my circumstance.


Quote:
6. that a non BMW dealer had the fuel pump to your bike in stock makes you a very lucky buckaroo. It's unlikely that even a BMW dealer would have the part on the shelf.
Yes, I was fortunate. The part was ordered by the shop and the customer had skipped on the appointment and the part had been there for a while. Lucky, yes, incredible.

Quote:
7. There is no way for anyone but a lab that can disassemble your pump and conduct sophisticated tests on its various parts to know that your pump failed because of ethanol in the gas.
Modern gas is extremely susceptible to damage fuel component if left untreated in the system. This is a known issue especially for older carburetor bikes. This discussion had been quite involved with an ex Honda guy who was one the development team for one of the "Other" 6 cylinder bike (*Honda CBX) who happens to be the premier rebuilder of only old school carbs, (Welcome to The Motorcycle Project!) and knows the properties/problems of modern fuels, additives, etc. Yes, he is not an authorized BMW tech and has probably never seen a K1600 but his extreme in-depth knowledge of fuel properties is unquestionable. He explained to me the disruptive nature of modern gas left in any fuel system. Now, to be fair, this failure would have to be sent to a lab for analysis and then the outcome would have been the same conclusion with a high confidence level that the gas caused the failure. Could it have been FOD? (Foreign object debris) Not at all likely with the sophisticated filter system within the fuel system.

This is a Scientific paper written of the destructive properties of ethanol based fuels:
"Abstract. Generally, ethanol fuel emits less pollutants than gasoline, it is completely renewable product and has the potential to reduce greenhouse gases emission but, at the same time can present a multitude of technical challenges to engine operation conditions including creation of very adverse engine deposits. These deposits increasing fuel consumption and cause higher exhaust emissions as well as poor performance in drivability."
Link: HERE

Quote:
8. It is highly unlikely in any case that your fuel pump would have failed due to ethanol in the gas as there are no parts in it that would have been affected by ethanol. So, please forgive me if I am wrong; but somehow, I'm not buying your story; or as is sometimes said on this forum: I'm calling BS.
The tolerance levels of a fuel pump on this bike are high. There is no "Wiggle room" for gas that went stale and created a gunk that prevented the pump from operating. Now I was wondering why you would go to such extremes to dispute my post. For reasons unknown your "Expertise" may have been challenged by my post or perhaps you think I am new to Motorcycles, (*I have 9 bikes, rebuilt 4 from the ground up, been riding for 43 years) and I have been a professional Pilot my entire life and mechanics are not new to me. Of course my Aviation background and the years spent in classrooms discussing fuel and other unrelated mechanics does not qualify me as an expert in the field of modern BMW bikes, but does allow my the ability to comprehend in depth discussions on this subject.

It was not
Quote:
bs
and frankly what a unwelcome post to a new member here.
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Sky

Last edited by Skyguyz; 07-16-2017 at 01:57 PM.
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post #10 of 23 Old 07-16-2017, 12:43 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RL Lemke View Post
There was a fuel pump recall.

You are home and you have a good dealer off 215 that can look everything over. To make sure all recalls and updates are done. To make sure everything is as it should be. $330 to get home was affordable.
Yes, the bike is due for it's first BMW service. This bike will get the complete "Look-see"
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Sky
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