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International Man of Mystery
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Riding position is a joke to me. Totally overcooked design leaves the form follows function philosophy in the dirt. They will end up with a lot of disgruntled ex Harley owners as new customers. Good luck with that demographics.......
 

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International Man of Mystery
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see my post on bike not fit for purpose i had untold problems with the last bike
and i have to agree its bmw not the dealers
but that said brought 6 k1600 so it's not they have not had their fair shear of my money over the years plus all the clothing boots helmets you name it
Only made it to four from 2014 till today. Wow.
 
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You wanna know what I think? Probably not but your going to hear it anyways.😜

We all put that benchmark badge on too high of a pedestal. These bikes we ride are no more expensive than the equivalent touring bikes from Honda or Harley but for some reason we as buyers think that these BMW bikes we buy should be without trouble based purely on the fact they are a BMW and they cost so much money. I got a news flash for you.. Honda and Harley owners think the exact same way and theres just as many brand hater threads on those forums as there is here. Actually.. Harley forums are the worst by far. Those guys bitch and moan about how the MoCo is just in it for the money and they will never buy another one.. 3 months later the same asshat is posting pictures of his brand new motorcycle he got suckered into trading for when he was down at the dealership looking at t-shirts and chrome accessories for his old one. Coincidently enough.. the same old bike he proudly announced to everyone on the forum that he just paid off 6 months prior.

Back on topic.
Should they be without fault.. sure but its beyond me to believe they can make xxxxx bikes a year and have them all perform perfectly. Honda's new Wingdinger isnt without faults nor are the new Harleys, they all have quirks. Looking back can you name any BMW motorcycle built in the last 20 years that was absolutely flawless? That ran without breakdowns, no final drive issues, no rear ESA shock issues, no fuel strip issues, no fork seal issues, no loose rusty spokes.. They built many great motorcycles but very fecking few of them without some sort of issues. While these issues might be less with other brands, those bring their own challenges to the table as well.

That said, todays buyers read online forums like this to get a feel for the bike they would like to own. They read very little good, all the bad and with eyes wide shut... go buy one anyways. Or. Like the op here who has had several BMW's and had issues with all of them.. well why did he buy the last one then? I dont blame anyone for switching brands, I did it my self 6 years ago and have been perfectly happy ever since. Thankfully theres more here that are happy than disappointed, and that holds true across every brand. If your not happy then go buy something that blows your skirt up
My thought too. No bike is without failures. These are huge engines packed in a smal body, and ridden in all types of environments. They wear down, and manufacturing issue do exist. No amount of QA will prevent this. As motorcyclists we need to either be prepared to pay for maintenance and repairs, or learn to do the work, but the work has to be done no matter the brand. I don’t know anyone that purchased an HD without having to have some warranty issues addressed by the first maintenance window. Frankly, I rather love that I have a 1600+ cc motorcycle that rides like a 500cc racer. The ride is so smooth and balanced, I could never get an HD. I am not a brand loyalist at though. If I buy 2nd bike, maybe it will be a Triumph Tiger, or a Ducati Monster (or multistrada) but when it comes to long distance touring bikes, I don’t see a better choice than my Grand America...
 

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Discussion Starter #104 (Edited)
My thought too. No bike is without failures. These are huge engines packed in a smal body, and ridden in all types of environments. They wear down, and manufacturing issue do exist. No amount of QA will prevent this. As motorcyclists we need to either be prepared to pay for maintenance and repairs, or learn to do the work, but the work has to be done no matter the brand. I don’t know anyone that purchased an HD without having to have some warranty issues addressed by the first maintenance window. Frankly, I rather love that I have a 1600+ cc motorcycle that rides like a 500cc racer. The ride is so smooth and balanced, I could never get an HD. I am not a brand loyalist at though. If I buy 2nd bike, maybe it will be a Triumph Tiger, or a Ducati Monster (or multistrada) but when it comes to long distance touring bikes, I don’t see a better choice than my Grand America...
When it works, the K1600 is amazing.
That shouldn't detract from the fact that a 26000kms flagship BMW / German bike ends up spending no less than 6 months waiting for parts and fixes this year, because of all sorts of major failures. It doesn't really help that the K1600 is amazing if I can't ride it, and / or if I have to treat it like an exotic race bike, with big chunks needing expensive replacements every few months (with normal, daily usage, no track days or anything). That is the real problem.

Partial update to the initial post: I've tried to contact BMW through the official channels - social media directed me to a generic German email address, I got a few automatic replies telling me how seriously they take my situation ... and then I got an email from the same useless BMW UK Customer service who, directed me to ... a generic BMW car website in Romania. Every BMW representative "understands how disappointed I am" and tells me "I'm being taken very seriously" yet nobody is really doing anything to keep me happy and motivated as a customer (and to get me back on the road asap). Big mistake - that's all I can say. I feel I've been taken for a fool with this whole mess, and I will not take this, anymore.
 

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Every BMW representative "understands how disappointed I am" and tells me "I'm being taken very seriously" yet nobody is really doing anything to keep me happy and motivated as a customer (and to get me back on the road asap). Big mistake - that's all I can say. I feel I've been taken for a fool with this whole mess, and I will not take this, anymore.
It appears you're fighting the battle by yourself -- no Dealer going to bat for you. Otherwise you wouldn't be making all these calls and effectively chasing your own tail.

During the process of my recent engine replacement (under warranty), I know my Dealer GM had more than one heated conversation with the BMW-HQ. There were times HE hit roadblocks moving things forward, even with his already established relationships and status. What I learned from the whole ordeal is having a competent dealer and having a great relationship with them is worth more than gold for addressing BMW issues. I'd have accomplished little by myself. Good luck with your efforts.
 

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International Man of Mystery
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It appears you're fighting the battle by yourself -- no Dealer going to bat for you. Otherwise you wouldn't be making all these calls and effectively chasing your own tail.

During the process of my recent engine replacement (under warranty), I know my Dealer GM had more than one heated conversation with the BMW-HQ. There were times HE hit roadblocks moving things forward, even with his already established relationships and status. What I learned from the whole ordeal is having a competent dealer and having a great relationship with them is worth more than gold for addressing BMW issues. I'd have accomplished little by myself. Good luck with your efforts.
I have to agree with the importance of a good relationship to your dealer. These guys are between a rock and a hard place when it comes to serious product quality issues as they are contractual partner both of the customer and BMW. Not BMW gets sued by the customer, but the dealer will and if he loses the case he sits on a problem bike with no support from BMW. Best strategy is to build moderate pressure on the dealer while not damaging the relationship allowing the dealer to make the case with BMW. If that fails, then burning bridges by getting the lawyers involved is the final option. As much as I am inclined to jump the gun, I will get the factory rep for a one on one to discuss matters which all by itself is an accomplishment I would have never got close to without my dealer. At the end of the day, it is very often not the quality problems that pisses off customers, but the handling of it.
 

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I have to agree with the importance of a good relationship to your dealer. These guys are between a rock and a hard place when it comes to serious product quality issues as they are contractual partner both of the customer and BMW. Not BMW gets sued by the customer, but the dealer will and if he loses the case he sits on a problem bike with no support from BMW. Best strategy is to build moderate pressure on the dealer while not damaging the relationship allowing the dealer to make the case with BMW. If that fails, then burning bridges by getting the lawyers involved is the final option. As much as I am inclined to jump the gun, I will get the factory rep for a one on one to discuss matters which all by itself is an accomplishment I would have never got close to without my dealer. At the end of the day, it is very often not the quality problems that pisses off customers, but the handling of it.
Well stated. The one time the dealer GM got a little heated with me was when I suggested pursuing a buyback during the dog days of the process. He essentially told me I'd be cutting him off at the knees, and at that point I'd be completely on my own. I got the message and allowed ordeal to play out. I'm glad I did.
 

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Sir Robin’s Lead Minstrel
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The generalizations are just stupid!

Most Reliable Motorcycle Companies in 2020 (Dependable Options!) Here are some repair facts by brand

I have found good people on every kind of bike I can think of, even scooters :)
I'll admit I've been entertained with this thread, but some folks are taking this back and forth too personally.

First, I think we all know if reliability is far and away the most important factor to someone, they stand an overall greater chance of having an extremely reliable bike if you buy from the Japanese Big 4 than any other brand. Who has argued otherwise?

And of course you've found good people on every kind of bike and scooter. No one has said EVERY Harley rider, or BMW rider is [insert bad thing x or bad thing y]. The statements come across to me as "most," not "all". Instead, I'm seeing too many folks take personal offense at a something which is only an opinion first, and even then, that most riders in a category are a certain way, not them or their friends or family.

It's like:
"I'm mad at him."
"Why?"
"He just said most Harley riders were drunken barhoppers!"
"Are YOU a drunken barhopper?"
"No."
"Then why would YOU care?"

I do TOTALLY get if someone's had too much of a bad experience for them, they need to move along, BMW, Harley or otherwise.

But life's too short to be offended by mere disagreement. Buy and ride what you like. And be safe when you ride.
 

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Sir Robin’s Lead Minstrel
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All this unfounded talk of BMW riders being surly is offensive, I tells ya. Just look at these happy, friendly guys. :ROFLMAO: :ROFLMAO:🥳 Once again, I'm going to he11 for my sense of humor.

145748
 

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So obviously the overheating problem has been around for a while, ever since WW 2. Is that why they all stopped on the side of the road? Flippin BMW quality!!!
 
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