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Discussion Starter · #181 ·
Can you switch between apps using the wonder wheel?
Nope, if you have the radio installed you can switch between radio on bike and music on phone.

You have to start whatever music App you want to use on your phone before you put the phone in the pocket or start the bike. The TFT will automatically start the BMW App if you forget to switch it on, but that's all.
 

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Nope, if you have the radio installed you can switch between radio on bike and music on phone.

You have to start whatever music App you want to use on your phone before you put the phone in the pocket or start the bike. The TFT will automatically start the BMW App if you forget to switch it on, but that's all.
That's what I thought. Thanks for replying.
 

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David et al.

One more question! On the Nav VI when the fuel level goes orange you get a fuel symbol on the screen of the Nav Unit, if you press that it shows a list of petrol stations en route and distance and direction with an arrow - the PoI feature.

Does the TFT solution have both PoIs and that feature when the fuel level is low?

I often use the PoI to find restaurants etc. I guess the search is with the wonder wheel given the TFT is not touch screen.
 

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Discussion Starter · #184 ·
David et al.

One more question! On the Nav VI when the fuel level goes orange you get a fuel symbol on the screen of the Nav Unit, if you press that it shows a list of petrol stations en route and distance and direction with an arrow - the PoI feature.

Does the TFT solution have both PoIs and that feature when the fuel level is low?

I often use the PoI to find restaurants etc. I guess the search is with the wonder wheel given the TFT is not touch screen.
Yes you have POI"s available on the TFT and you can use the wonder wheel to select a category e.g. fuel/parking. Don't know about restaurant's.
 

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Yes you have POI"s available on the TFT and you can use the wonder wheel to select a category e.g. fuel/parking. Don't know about restaurant's.
And what happens when the fuel level is low, is there a one-touch option to find petrol stations?
 

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I couldn't download some ITunes to the SD card that I used to put in the NAV VI for music selection there so I went to Google Music
That must've been a long time ago! Apple went DRM free in 2009.
You have to start whatever music App you want to use on your phone before you put the phone in the pocket or start the bike.
Thats pretty silly and "so 5 years ago". Should be able to use a voice command.

For example, "play my motorcycle playlist on PowerAmp"

New technology that is already outdated!

Another reason why it should've had Android Auto and CarPlay compatibility.
 

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Here in Norway this is called "tvilling-SIM" wich directly translates to "twin-sim". Here is a google translated text about this from my provider Telenor: "Gemini is the service for you who use several mobile phones. You get an extra SIM card and can use the phones with the same subscription and the same number."
I thought this was a standard that was offered all over the world, but maybe it is not offered in the UK. I see that Vodafone has something the call OneNumber but it only seems to be supported with certain smartwatches.
Lucky you - for some reason the option of having two sim-cards for one phone number is not offered in Denmark :-/ It used to be some 10-12 years ago, but not anymore.
 

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@OSCS I start my music with a simple voice command. To me, that should be a bottom line requirement.
I agree with this too, in my bmw car, i can say "listen to radio 2" or "turn the heated steering wheel on" or "navigate home" etc.

However I don't agree with apple car play or android auto, often you get hire cars where that's the Nav unit and you have to fiddle around for 15 minutes to get going. Really I prefer an integrated nav unit that knows distance and turns based upon data from the vehicle and isn't solely reliant on GPS and a mobile data connection. Maybe I'm old school, but it feels solid state and reliable.
 

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That must've been a long time ago! Apple went DRM free in 2009.
I was happy with iTunes, it worked well with the iPod which I was sad to see go. The app was OK but bulkier being on the phone. I kept using iTunes but then found that I couldn't transfer all my music to a USB or SD to play in the bike. I agree a lot of my iTunes music could be played but some stuff didn't and apple don't offer the mp3 format even though I bought the music.

So on the principle of not liking to be locked in I moved to Google play that imported all my music except for the funny format iTunes stuff. So I bought what I really liked again.

To be honest had I known that it was only my older songs that are a none standard format I would have probably stayed with them. My fear was that I would buy something new and it would be in this iTunes only format so I couldn't play.
 

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Really I prefer an integrated nav unit that knows distance and turns based upon data from the vehicle and isn't solely reliant on GPS and a mobile data connection.
FWIW, although it was present on high-end systems up until a few years ago, very few integrated automotive navigation systems still have a dead reckoning capability that uses wheel and steering sensors as inputs. The vast majority now just use GPS, and supplement that with a mobile data connection for dynamic POI information.

I can sort of understand why automotive manufacturers are moving away from integrated navigation systems to Carplay and Android Auto. The technology evolves quickly in the consumer electronics world and the requirement to provide spares and service not just during the production run, but for many years after production ceases has become too onerous. Much simpler (and cheaper!) to provide a relatively open interface that affords the end user the ability to operate their ever evolving portable devices via the vehicle's controls.

Returning to the Motorrad TFT implementation, the fundamental thing that BMW seem to have failed to appreciate is that motorcyclists are exposed to the vagaries of the weather in a way a car driver isn't. Having to fiddle about with a mobile phone in the pi$$ing rain to either start applications or plug in a charge cable or stow it in some compartment on the bike is ludicrous. Much better to have a touch screen that can be operated with gloves on, and/or voice actuation, and an architecture that doesn't cause such high power drain on the phone so it can be left on a rider's person.

The dedicated Nav XX navigation solution where the bike has a dedicated integration port and the functional device can be updated or replaced as technology evolves was (and is) a very effective solution. From an end user point of view, it wasn't broken and didn't need fixing.
 
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Discussion Starter · #194 ·
Don't forget the TFT software and BMW App software is written by "Geeks" who don't ride motorcycles and would be offended if they had to ask a motorcyclist what they wanted.

Voice control technology has been around for ages, these things are libraries that can be incorporated into applications with little effort and it would have been a game changer for the new technology if it had been incorporated into the project. Just imagine being able to talk to your bike and ask it to "Check Engine Temp" or "Navigate to next Fuel location".

A couple of other things to get frustrated over, the TFT is not interested in how you order your contacts either by first name or last name, it gives it to you in last name order like it or not. That's fine if that is the way you want it but not fine if you are used to finding a contact by first name.

If you have an Android phone you will not get any music art or playlists, you will get this if you have an iOS phone. When we asked why, the answer came back from BMW "Insufficient Memory"..

I can only conclude from this statement that the developer that was asked to do the work on the music art for Android phones had "Insufficient Memory" and therefore forgot about it.
 

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Don't forget the TFT software and BMW App software is written by "Geeks" who don't ride motorcycles
Oh, I've never had any illusions over that.

When I worked in software engineering it was a given that in order to design an effective solution, you first had to properly identify and understand the requirements. But we're now in an era of rapid development where time to market and having the latest bit of "eye candy" are more important than delivering something that genuinely satisfies real needs.
 
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Just imagine being able to talk to your bike and ask it to "Check Engine Temp" or "Navigate to next Fuel location".
I've just recorded some examples from my car showing typical voice control I use. As this car is 2021 I figured a 2022 bike would be going the next step.

Start car, turn on heated seat, select radio station, select music online :

Check tyre pressure :

Find petrol station :

If only my motorbike manufacturer knew how to do this, oh wait...
 

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Discussion Starter · #197 · (Edited)
@TouringTim You are expecting BMW Motorrad to talk to BMW cars !!!!!!!

How silly is that thought, it will be 10 years before Motorrad get around to it and that will only happen when one of the "Geeks" grows up and rides a motorcycle.
 

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@TouringTim You are expecting BMW Motorrad to talk to BMW cars !!!!!!!

How silly is that thought, it will be 10 years before Motorrad get around to it and that will only happen when on of the "Geeks" grows up and rides a motorcycle.
They are quite big on the word connected
 

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@DavidMcK natural language recognition is still a work in progress. Cardo is the leader for this in motorcycle headset communications. My experience with Sena is that they still have a ways to go. The message is that’s it’s not a trivial technology to incorporate. I suspect that BMW in their TFT development looked at the cost benefit and decided to pass.

I’m skeptical of any motorcycle communications solution where the phone can’t easily be connected directly to the headset. I know you suggested connecting a second phone and some other awkward gymnastics, but complexity leads to unforeseen problems, and most riders don’t need that.

It will be interesting to see real world setups once the new K16s hit the road. Riders can be ingenious with workarounds to get the functionality they want.
 
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