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Do you feel more stringent identity measures are necessary for this site for those who sell?

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Techmeister
K1600GA
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2,092 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
I am asking the question (not driven by other moderators or events) if it is to the advantage of members overall if we had, then employed, more stringent authentication and identification measures?

I do not know if we have access to better measures. I do not know if other members support more stringent measures. I am asking if it is a good idea?

Pros: You know who someone is to the degree that they passed automated security checks such as the ones your bank or PayPal uses.
Cons: We know more about you and a real dark actor can bypass most automated measures with a dedicated campaign. These measures work because it is generally accepted among bad actors that leaving a footprint is bad, and the effort of cultivating an act is too much effort. Most head to easier pastures; call your Mom.

Not directly related but check out "I Care A Lot" on Netflix.

There are many ways of doing this, some more intrusive than others. For one example, sellers may have a "tag" with their signature - a bit like the license plate on your bike. Or, they may need to validate a bank account if you want to be extreme. Buyers are protected from sellers, so it is sellers that have to pass muster. Then again, perhaps both parties should be known.

OPINION:
A real consideration for me is that there are real stores here, that pay to be here, and who may be negatively impacted, both by more stringent measures, and fly-by-night sellers. I feel vendors who pay to be here should be favored to the degree that outside sellers of a commercial nature should respect them and their efforts to support the community. This is David talking and no one else.
 

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288 Posts
What can we do that is free for the site and not too intrusive? What are the options? I have sold about 6 items and bought about the same from the site with no issues but have received those scam PMs as well. Maybe a seller/buyer rating? Again, options?
 

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Techmeister
K1600GA
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2,092 Posts
Discussion Starter #4
What can we do that is free for the site and not too intrusive? What are the options? I have sold about 6 items and bought about the same from the site with no issues but have received those scam PMs as well. Maybe a seller/buyer rating? Again, options?
We can discuss if there is a general thumbs-up.
 

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KBiK
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1,791 Posts
Caveat Emptor. I think this site should concentrate on discussions about K1600 motorcycles and not pretend to be a vendor marketplace. The reputable vendors who support this site already have a dedicated location for their products and services. If other members want to sell single items they no longer need, then I think that any security around that transaction should be left to the members.

The XenForo software platform this site uses is designed as a community forum platform, not an e-commerce platform.

BTW, I enjoyed "I Care a Lot" last night but I see absolutely no connection to e-commerce or motorcycles :unsure: :unsure: :unsure:
 

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Premium Member
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44 Posts
Update to Post 2/21/21: Thank you for changing the wording of the survey question!

Original Post: 2/20/21: I apologize in advance if I'm over thinking this or just plain not understanding what is trying to be accomplished here. I need some clarity on which question I'm responding to with this survey. The title of the thread and the question in the survey ask two separate questions, which I would answer differently. I would agree that forum members that are selling personal items could agree to use tighter security. It would benefit all involved in a transaction. As for the actual survey question, I do not agree that more stringent identity measures are necessary for the site, in general.
 

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Q
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5,423 Posts
Fantastic post @amorley

The only thing I will add is this.. Maybe I dont know, out of the loop on something here. Most times changes are made to solve a problem but this seems like its an attempt to solve a problem that doesnt exist.

Its not a discussion forums job to provide security for those who wish to buy and sell on the forums pages. Lets leave the details to those using it, their big boys and can handle it themselves.

I didnt vote on the poll because frankly.... its stupid and there was no option for that.
 

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461 Posts
If individual members cannot recognize the spammers / scammers that's on them, I don't think we should be inconveniencing all members by adding additional hoops to jump through.

I've not been here long, but have bought from a fellow member (short throw shifter) and it was easy enough to assess whether the deal was legit.

My personal opinion is that a cautionary post sticky'd at the top of the Classified section is sufficient.
 

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Premium Member
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6,701 Posts
So has there been a problem? From what I read is that most (if not all) our members seem to be very cautious dealing with low posting count new members and voice their concerns to warn others. Our administrators have acted quickly to silence questionable posters.

Members who have posted several times on other subjects and then sell something have already left a good footprint of who they are. Many of us have gotten to know each other, one way or another, and get a warm feeling when dealing with them on a sale item. It's pretty easy to shut a bad actor down.

No matter what security is in place the adage "buyer beware" is always in play. Using payments through credit cards, PayPal and such have provisions for money retrieval if a deal goes bad.

As a final note I agree with Andy's assessment of what this forum is all about. I would like to give dj a shout out for thinking of new things for us to ponder while waiting for riding season to begin again.
 

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Techmeister
K1600GA
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2,092 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
My driver was to open the discussion; I appreciate your view. I personally don't have a dog in this fight, but it is good to give voice to the question. At this moment, a little less than half the members are concerned enough.

How do you identify a scam in progress?
 

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Premium Member
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6,701 Posts
. At this moment, a little less than half the members are concerned enough.
Well a little less than half of the 31 that responded to the survey. As of now 321 have looked at the thread.
 

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Premium Member
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1,792 Posts
I know there are spammers and con artists out there. But has it been a big problem on this site?

I'm a member of another forum that includes an "iTrader" rating and feedback score for each member. It's very much like the ratings used by eBay, where buyers and sellers have a reputation that's built by transacting with other members. But I wonder how often an individual member buys or sells something on this site. For instance, I personally haven't bought or sold anything here for a long time. So I would still have a "zero" rating.
 

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Premium Member
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Can I change my vote to #4?
 
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Super Moderator
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Two factor authentication ( 2FA ) with a phone number wouldn't be that hard to do. 2FA with an email is too easy to fake all you have to do is create a fake email address. At least with a phone number a person would need to have a disposable phone to fake their credentials, and it's not trivial (that means its time consuming and has a cost). Here's the bottom line, security isn't for those who want everything easy. Easy makes things less secure. The more difficult it is to infiltrate a network (or forum) the less likely someone will spend time here and go for other low hanging fruit or someplace where there are regular financial transactions. The basic idea of electronic security is to secure information for as long as it has value. In the world of electronic security there are 3 things that can be used to authenticate a user. Something you know (password), Something you have (key or token) or Something you are (bio metrics). 2FA requires the use of two of those things. The most common is a password and token. The token is done via a call back to a person's mobile phone, where the electronic token is installed during the initial setup. So before you could log in you put your password in (how many of you have your username and password remembered by your computer?) and then click on something on your mobile phone to allow you to gain access to the web site. Many people will probably reject this as it's too hard or too much work. Some businesses reject it for various reasons, such as cost or they don't believe their information has enough value to anyone or they don't want to alienate users. The bottom line is that's it's a good way to keep the riff raff away, but also requires more work from everyone to implement and to use. But it will make the site more secure. Of course our forum is open to everyone which is sort of the idea and is searchable by Google and other search engines, that has the possibility to change with 2FA depending on how things can be setup. So everyone can take a deep breath, I'm not involved with doing anything like that here, and the all powerful have not spoken to me about it. This is a discussion limited to this thread only.
 
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