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Discussion Starter #1
Just looking for opinions here.
I don't mind getting oil on my hands but I'm tired of burning them.
So you see where I'm going with this. :smile:

Joe
 

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I guess that Castrol we ordered on Amazon Prime Day today just can’t there fast enough. :wink:
 

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Just looking for opinions here.
I don't mind getting oil on my hands but I'm tired of burning them.
So you see where I'm going with this. :smile:

Joe
I'll run the engine for just a couple of minutes before changing the oil and I guess the only reason I do that is to get the contaminants, if any, off the bottom of the oil pan and into the oil. Even if it flows better when good and hot, it's too hard to handle and splashes around too easily.
 

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First off, I assume you are wearing gloves. Harborfreight now has 5, 7 and 9 mil gloves. I still have some 5mil ones left, but I'll probably try some 7 or 9 next, which should do an even better job insulating from the hot oil. The 5mil actually does a pretty good job already, but it rips too easily, especially when my hands are drenched in sweat this time of the year.

I prefer to let out the churned up engine oil ASAP, so any entrained contaminants have a better chance of getting flushed out with the used oil. I pretty much open the bottom (outside) drain plug right after warning up the engine. At that point, I'm more leery of the hot exhaust flanking the oil sump. I usually wear thick leather gloves to crack the drain plug loose first, then switch to the nitrile gloves to spin it out, which I can do without much oil getting on my fingers.

At that point, I just let the bottom sump drain out and switch my attention to the oil filter. I probably could do that in 2min if I rush, but I just take my time. Maybe go inside the house to cool off a bit from the hot Houston Summer heat.

By the time I am done snugging up the replacement filter, putting my oil filter wrench away, packaging up the old oil filter in a plastic bag, so on and so forth, the oil - and more importantly, the exhaust pipes - have cooled off substantially. That's when I remove the inner drain plug. The oil is still hot, but not dangerously so. The exhaust pipes are also not hot enough to burn me, if I accidentally bump my hand against it.
 

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I have done my share of oil changes on multiple vehicles and aircraft thru the years. Hot right after a long run, overnight cold, as well as after several days sitting. I have pretty much gone to the ways of a hot post ride and waiting an hour to drop both plugs. Change out the filter and let sit for another hour draining. Then measure the exact amount of oil needed and replace. 80% first filling run the bike for 5 minutes and finish the remaining new oil.

Nothing doing but a test to know for sure about just how much contaminants will settle out of circulated oil. I captured my last oil change oil and put it into a couple of containers to check on later.
After 1 day I didn't really see much in the way of sediment. The second container after 1 week was a different story. Cold sludge - an almost molasses type sediment was evident. I really could not pore the sediment out at that point so I know it seemingly wouldn't flow from a cold crankcase either.

In closing, it is MHO that a warm oil change after the bike cools from a long ride suites me. For sure not a change after sitting for a week just before leaving for an extended trip!

Andy
 

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I've changed the oil in all my vehicles cold. :surprise: In my feeble mind I figure whatever sediment is left in the oil pan will be stirred up in the new oil and filtered out by the new oil filter besides I'll be draining a little more oil because it's had all night to drain down out of the engine. All the crud in the old oil didn't hurt the engine the day before I changed it so a small percentage left after I change it can't hurt either. Your experience and mileage may vary.
 

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Some heavy duty pain killers an hour before the drain...your hands will still burn, but you won't feel it. Actually, insulated gloves (similar to Playtex kitchen gloves) work well for me. Decent amount of insulation and while it still feels plenty warm, it's not scalding.
 

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I do all my vehicles cold and have done so for 30 years with never an oil related engine failure. In fact never had an engine failure. I've tried hot more than once including the K16 and I see no benefit to the burning hands and fire hose of oil spraying all over the garage other than turning a 10 minute job into a 60 minute one plus a shower and change of clothes.

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I'm also in the camp of changing it cold, but really it's more for convenience than anything. I have asked why oil is changed hot, many times on different forums not just for motorcycles. The only answer that made sense was, if the engine oil is hot, it will drain quicker. So, I pull the plugs when it's cold, and let it sit for a day. I have the time, I'm retired! It's hot when I park it, cools to cold as it sits and when I drain it, all the sediment that is going to come out is in the bottom of the pan. I figure, if I started and ran it until it was warm/hot, it's just taking the dirty oil back up into the engine. And you won't get all that oil back until it's cooled again. Quicker if it's hot, more volume if it's cold. To get the benefit of both, I guess you could pull the plugs when it's hot and then let it sit until it cold? YMMV

I suppose, as science project, someone could change oil both ways, and test the new oil and filter for contaminants right after changing. Any volunteers?
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Actually, insulated gloves (similar to Playtex kitchen gloves) work well for me. Decent amount of insulation and while it still feels plenty warm, it's not scalding.
I've tried gloves but they're too slippery when removing the inner plug so I end up taking them off.

Joe
 

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I did do something un-scientifically similar and reported in my last post. Not to whip the ole dead horse any further. As a mechanic who has disassembled many engines I can assure you oil in a sump will settle out over time. The consequence of not changing oil have been documented with devastating effects. Conversely, the sludge left behind after combustion will eventually settle and separate from the oil over time and oil filters will filter what they can and bypass the rest. This time span has not been documented in so much.

My conclusion: The temp of the oil will not effect much if any on the sediment in suspension but time will. As we all know synthetic oils will flow with a much greater temp range that their predecessor, dino. The OP's question was about what temp to change? I choose to change my oils in everything I operate after the oil cools significantly at the end of an extended ride, in our case here; :)30 minutes or more after running thru the gears on a wet clutch system like our K's) and well before the oil has a chance to settle out.

There is no argument from me as to what temp - just do it before the oil cools and sits for any length of time. The oil journals for the most part aren't designed to hold or restrict oils from returning easily to the circulation pick up point. And most drain plugs are colocated for better results. So engines don't usually hold oils for any length of time.

I have never had an equipment failure associated with changing oil too frequently after break-in, whether cold or hot!

Andy
 

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So I guess there you go. Some like it hot some like it cold and then there are those that like it just right. 0:)
 

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Discussion Starter #17 (Edited)
Good input guys. Thanks.
I think a good compromise for me is to ride it...let it cool off a bit...then have at it.

If I remember correctly, a while back someone recommended some Skate board tape to wrap around the 5mm hex to make your grip more secure when removing the plug from the upper sump. Going to give that a try as well.

Probably get to it on Sunday.

Joe
 

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Good input guys. Thanks.
I think a good compromise for me is to ride it...let it cool off a bit...then have at it.

If I remember correctly, a while back someone recommended some Skate board tape to wrap around the 5mm hex to make your grip more secure when removing the plug from the upper sump. Going to give that a try as well.

Probably get to it on Sunday.

Joe
Actually the skate board tape was put on a 1/4" drive extension that snaps into the RL Super Plug. If you don't have one and are using the hex key don't worry if you drop the plug it will be trapped near the drain hole and it's magnetic and can be fished out with a small diameter magnet. Make sure you DON'T use a ball end hex key only a crisp straight sided one seeing as how the hex socket in the plug is very shallow and conducive to stripping out.
 

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Do you think there's probably a reason I don't recall ever reading in any manufacturer's maintenance manual to warm up the engine prior to an oil change?

Duane
 
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