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Sena SM10 = Dual Streaming BT Nirvana

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23K views 44 replies 23 participants last post by  Maggy  
#1 ·
I seriously love my K1600GTL. But I have never loved the audio system. I refused to spend $2200 to get the full Bluetooth experience from BMW including two helmets that didn't fit. I've struggled with the Cardo G4 (pretty bad) and the Sena SMH10 (much better) but I was always annoyed that my passenger was prevented from listening to the audio system and that the wonder wheel didn't control the volume if I wanted to use Bluetooth. I was also annoyed by the lack of input level control that caused distortion on FM and Sat Radio and a barely audible Nav when using Bluetooth.

I did install a couple of 3.5mm jacks so I could connect the SMH10s via wire. That works well and solves all of the above issues. Well it doesn't give individual input level control, but the default levels to the speakers are much better than the Bluetooth, so isn't nearly the same issue.

The problem is the wires. I really wanted to go Bluetooth the way I felt BMW should have given me from the start. Now I've got it!

The new SM10 from Sena gives me exactly what I was looking for from the beginning. My total investment to make things the way they should be is right around $500 including the two SMH10's and the SM10, a power source, a ground loop isolator and all cables and connectors.

I should mention that I am no audiophile. Bluetooth compression definitely flattens out music, but that is true regardless of the headset. I can live without wired quality at highway speeds. My ears can't tell the difference anyway. And if I wanted to get the highest quality I could out of the Bluetooth, I'd go with ear buds on the SMH10's instead of helmet speakers. In any event, the sound quality from the SM10 sounds as good as or better than the K1600 Bluetooth to me, so I've lost nothing there.

Most of this has been covered elsewhere, but for those new to the forum who want to get a Bluetooth system going that works for both the rider and the pillion and is fully controllable from the wonder wheel, here is what I did.

The idea is to tap into the bike's speaker wires to get the audio to the SM10. If you've already installed a 3.5mm jack, the SM10 is pretty much just plug and play. But I'm assuming starting from scratch. With that in mind here is what you need:

1. 2 X Sena SMH10 headsets. Sena says you can use most any headset with the SM10, but the SMH10s are as good as it gets, IMHO and we know they work great with the SM10.

2. 1 X Sena SM10

If you don't power the SM10 off the bike and you intend to only use it powered by its own battery that you will have to charge, you can skip the isolator in #3. Otherwise:

3. You will need a way to block ground loops since you will be powering the SM10 and the Alpine stereo from different sources. Many here have used either the Autocom 3.5mm Stereo Isolation Lead, or the Autocom Factory-type Stereo Music Lead with Toggle Switch . You will likely want a switch in this application, more on that shortly.

My problem with the Autocom choices is that they are way too expensive and the level reduction is not adjustable. You need to reduce the power level coming off the speaker wires you are going to tap as the level is too hot for anything other than speakers. The Autocom isolators will reduce the level, but they aren't adjustable so you are stuck with whatever level they give you. Also, the switch on the 2275 is a cheap piece of..., well it just ain't much. Particularly given how much extra it costs.

I went with the PAC SNI-35 Adjustable 2 channel line out converter For $14.35 on Amazon you get the ground loop block you need and adjustable levels for each channel. I get zero engine noise through this, which is the goal.

Whatever you use, this is the device that you will tap into the speaker wires. The SM10 goes on the output side of this device.

4. Assuming you didn't get the Autocom 2275, you probably want a toggle switch to shut off the speakers while you are using Bluetooth. Bluetooth requires compression and decompression, which takes time. The result is the speakers will be out of synch with your headsets. That won't sound too great. You will need a DPST switch if you want a simple on/off for both speakers, or DPDT if you want a center "mute" position. I picked up a black nylon rocker switch at the Shack for about $3 that I mounted above the audio system buttons on the left panel. It matches perfectly and looks like it belongs there to me. An alternative is to just cut the wires going to the speakers and be done with them if you don't think you will ever use them.



5. You need to power the SM10 if you don't want to take it out to charge. I found it easiest to just get a powerlet adapter to go from the powerlet outlet under the passenger with 24" of cable ending in a cigarette lighter adapter I put under the seat. The SM10 power cable can plug into that. Simple switched power. 24" Powerlet To Cigarette Socket Cable

6. You will need to get the appropriate cables to get from your ground loop block/isolator to the 3.5mm female input on the SM10. The Autocom isolators include a 3.5mm male. I used an RCA to 3.5mm adapter for my PAC SN-35.
Image
Image
Stereo 3.5mm Male to RCA cable


7. You will be tapping into the speaker wires to get your signal. Posi-taps are very popular. I'm a solder and shrink tube guy myself, but posi-taps and posi-twists will work just fine.
Image
Posi-tap Connectors.


This post gives you photos of the wires you will be tapping and this one gives you the color coding.

I found that with two helmets connected I was getting some drop outs on the SMH10s. That problem was solved by disabling "High Quality A2DP" using the SMH10 manager software. My ears cannot detect any difference in the sound quality but the drop outs are gone.

Also, you should reset your SMH10's to factory default settings prior to syncing up to the SM10 if you previously were paired to the K1600. It's probably a good idea to delete all the pairings on the K1600 since you won't be using them anymore. I didn't do either at first and it caused me some initial pairing problems and resulted in my SMH10 turning itself off when I inadvertently turned on the bike's Bluetooth.

With all of that assembled, you will have what we all should have gotten from the start, IMHO. That is an easy to use Bluetooth connection to rider and passenger for all of the audio system with full control from the wonder wheel, and without any requirement for a specific helmet or the need for turning things on in a specific order, saying magic words, swinging a dead chicken over your head or anything like that. It just works.
 
#3 ·
Sounds great.

The one thing I do not understand is all this talk about BT compression destroying the music fidelity. I have a pair of Jabra BT headphones I use at home and they sound beautiful. I do not think it is the BT on the bike killing Sirius music quality.
 
#4 · (Edited)
Great Review!
After spending years on Autocom, then Starcom, I dabbled in NCOM Nolan stuff, and now that we are selling Sena, I am being drawn to the stuff. Due to simple upgrading, decent sound, decent cost, and it proving time and again to work well, I am almost ready to give up the "wire"
http://www.rka-luggage.com/A01%20Products/prod.html
 
#5 ·
Great Review!
After spending years on Autocom, then Starcom, I dabbled in NCOM Nolan stuff, and now that we are selling Sena, I am being drawn to the stuff. Due to simple upgrading, decent sound, decent cost, and it proving time and again to work well, I am almost ready to give up the "wire"
RKA Products Page
Will you have any SM10's at CCR. If you do I would like to order one now. They are not available in Canada yet, so if you could bring one to CCR for me that would be GREAT.

Garry
 
#8 ·
sm10 & Scala

I have been using Q2's on bike (12 K16GT) without the bikes blue tooth. I bought a pair of G9's at MOA nationals with the promise they would work "like factory" but as of yet they will not work with the BMW. Will the sm10 work properly with either of these two models ?? Thanks Mark.
 
#9 ·


5. You need to power the SM10 if you don't want to take it out to charge. I found it easiest to just get a powerlet adapter to go from the powerlet outlet under the passenger with 24" of cable ending in a cigarette lighter adapter I put under the seat. The SM10 power cable can plug into that. Simple switched power. 24" Powerlet To Cigarette Socket Cable
Does the power shut off automatically on the SM10 or do you have to turn it off manually? Also, can you please post pictures of where you mounted everything? Thanks.
 
#11 ·
Where on your bike, did you mount the PAC SNI-35 and SM10?
Does the power shut off automatically on the SM10 or do you have to turn it off manually? Also, can you please post pictures of where you mounted everything? Thanks.
In answer to dreesq: I leave the SM10’s power switch in the ON position all the time. When external power is removed from the SM10, it will stay on until its battery goes to zilch. Assuming that you have turned off your headsets, this could be a very long time since it will go into “standby” mode after a few seconds. However, if the battery does die, it doesn’t matter in that as soon as the external power is restored, it will come right back on.
So while I can’t technically say that the SM10 will shut off when the power is removed, the result is the same anyway. When I turn on the bike, the SM10 always comes on and is ready to connect immediately.

This photo shows where I originally placed the SM10 and the PAC SNI-35. I have since moved the SM10. It is now mounted under the left passenger grab rail using the bar mount that is supplied with the SM10. I found that when placed under the seat, I would get an annoying number of drop outs while listening to music AND with a passenger seated and sharing the same music. This problem did not occur when riding solo. Once I got it out from under our butts, the drop outs were gone. I choose the position under the grab rail rather than on the handlebar because I thought the flashing blue and red leds would be way too distracting if on the handlebar in my field of view, the wiring would be much more complex there, and I would be inviting theft.
I have been using Q2's on bike (12 K16GT) without the bikes blue tooth. I bought a pair of G9's at MOA nationals with the promise they would work "like factory" but as of yet they will not work with the BMW. Will the sm10 work properly with either of these two models ?? Thanks Mark.
I haven’t tried any headsets other than the SMH10’s with the SM10 so I can’t tell you they will absolutely work. But I can’t see why they wouldn’t. The SM10 is using standard Bluetooth protocols. There is nothing here that is proprietary to Sena. In fact the specifications for the SM10 do not have any specific headset requirement. The exact wording is: “Along with the dual streaming feature of SM10, both you and your passenger may listen to the same music or radio at the same time by using Bluetooth headsets in the market.”
do you think the sm 10 would pair with the J&M blue tooth i have both the J&M and the BMW blue tooth for different helmets i use but J&M is making me a setup so my whistler pro 3600 will tie the voice or tones into my blue tooth from them
See the above response to miandy. Keep in mind that the SM10 has an AUX port specifically for mono inputs like radar detectors as well as the main stereo input. Assuming that the radar detector has an audio-out, you can connect it to the SM10's aux port and let the SM10 handle that as well. That should eliminate the need for the integration by J&M.
 
#14 ·
Well... got it up and running. Used a waterproof DPDT switch on the (+) side. It interrupts the speakers on the fairing and sends the signal to a 3.5mm female jack I put in the right fairing compartment where the USB and AUX in cable are. From there I used an attenuating cable from
, then went into a ground loop isolator also from
. Then into the SM10 which I powered via the USB port in the compartment.

So far, so good in static tests.. we'll ride tomorrow and test on the road.

I know it gets hot in that compartment, but I'll take the gamble
 
#15 ·
The coiled patch cord supplied by Sena had an issue with an internal short.... Drove me nuts finding it; I took all MY soldered connections down to look. Finally figured it out by noticing it got so hot... Like burning hot!

Replaced the Sena cord, and all is good
 
#16 ·
Hoepfully a post on this thread will bring it to the 'New Posts' page and some will answer. I' considering doing the Sensa SM10 update on my new GTL. I'm pretty good with a soldering iron and don't expect to have to use one much if what I read is correct and think this would be a good rainy Saturday afternoon project.

Can I ask how many have done the mod? Is it worth the trouble? What were the problems, if any?

Thanks in advance,

Ken
 
#17 ·
I don't know how many have done this, but I can say that two years later I still use this set-up daily and at least half the time two up. I found that the position of the SM10 can be critical to success in that many areas under the seat will result in sound drop-outs when riding two up with both riders listening to music. The final resting place I found was to the right and rear of the top-box plug, in the void just under the rear rack. At this location I get absolutely no drop outs.

It was well worth the trouble and cost for me, both of which were quite low.
 
#19 ·
Recently, a couple of us have taken this mod one step further and modified the SM10 itself so that it switches on/off with the bike. It's an easy modification and it works well. The benefit is that you don't have to make sure you keep the SM10 charged. Thread with details is here.
 
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#20 ·
Now I'm done!
Has taken a whole bunch of photos, mainly from "stripping" but info about removing the Tupperware is described elsewhere on this forum so I choose not to publish these photos.

This is the hardware I got.
- Avantree BTTC-200X Saturn Bluetooth Audio Adapter 2-in-1 Receiver + Transmitter
- Swith, double breaking capability
- High to low level filter
- Cables…

I made a harness consisting of USB-> MicroUSB both must be at least 1,5meter on a K1600 with "my" wiring route. In the pictures, there are two-meter cables.

To get the cables into the right glove compartment, I needed to get through the rubber grommet. First I drilled and then used a snap-off blade knife and made a cut in from the side with the holes wre drilled. In this way, you can then squeeze the cables sideways into the rubber. The lessons here: 1 Drill with high revolutions in the rubber. At first I drilled with a cordless drill but the holes were not so nice. Then I took a Dremel with a drill and it made a very good-looking hole. 2, Rubber glue you know that you have in the cabinet has dried up, guaranteed! Buy new rubber glue before so you avoid bad language when you are about to glue together the fine cut you made with the knife.

I chose to put connectors on my drains from the speaker wires. AMP model purchased some years ago at the auto parts store. Gets a little fancier for that day you might want to remove or alternatively replace the high to low level filter. Do not forget to set the level of the output signal! Do not start at maximum volume because then the risk is that you shoot the small Bluetooth transmitter in orbit ... and then invalidate the warranty! ;-)

Cable colors can be found at the speakers that you connect against ... or so browsing it on the internet and find what you want there.

So peeling man of little cable insulation so you can solder on ...


... Drain wires.

I chose to put the switch on the front speakers positive cable. Cut and soldered to a piece of cable that was long enough to where I wanted the speaker cut off switch.

I put the speaker cut off switch to the right of the GPS hole where there was good space behind.

This is how it looks underneath the saddles. To the left, a USB and lighter socket l purchased at auto parts store. Since I converted to GT saddle on my GTL space was available. Made a plate for recitifier (???) and let it stretch out to the left and stuck the high to low level filter on with 3M double adhesive tape.
All cables secured with cable ties and solder insulated with vulcanising tape.

Continues in next post...
 

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#21 ·
Insulated cable lugs to speaker cables with vulcanising tape as well.

With the rear seat in place, it looks like this.

Populated right glove compartment.

Test opinion:
Paired up my Scala Rider G9 headset to the transmitter. Simple and good. Thumbwheel works to raise and lower the volume with the! Jippie!
But ... on the model of the BT transmitter I bought cannot charge while you are using it. I would have liked to use the SENA SM10 but it was hard to find anywhere to buy it here in Sweden.
The phone I pair directly with the G9.
The function to call from the BMW Navigator 5 is not working anymore ... but one should not call while driving. Answering is easy done on the G9 by voice command or keystroke.
Everything works so far, which I liked so now I test out this season and see if I upgrade to SENA SM10 or not later.
I really recommend this upgrade for us who do not use the BMW original Bluetooth headset.

Now I have to find out if it is possible to get the smart phone link to connect to the internet as my phone now is paired with the headset instead of the bike.
 

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#23 ·
New year... new bike GTLE 2016 will arrive soon.
So on the new bike I will go the SENA SM10 route. Then I don't need to get the bike apart to get the cables into the right "glove compartment".
This thread is one of the better ones on the whole forum.
 

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#25 ·
Just made another install... now on my still new unridden GTLE.
This time with a SM10.
Made my own power cable of the one that came along with the SENA SM10.
Tapped into the backside of the power outlet under the right hand side fairing. Soldered all connections to original cables.
Speaker off button on the same place as on the last install.
Now I just have to finish my "on call duty" and get some serious riding done.
 

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#41 ·
I too was greatly disappointed with the Bluetooth audio quality on my GT. I tried everything to get it right, but the music quality was always unacceptable. Eventually I went with the autoCom 2275, and a set of Bose Noise Cancelling Earbuds. I now have the sound quality and functionality I want, but still can't excuse BMW's Bluetooth, and would prefer to be wireless. I have Streaming Bluetooth in my Cadillac CTS, as well as my Jeep Grand Cherokee, no wires, no muss, no fuss, and the audio quality is excellent. I don't agree the Bluetooth technology is the problem, BMW is the problem, and they just continue to ignore this issue model year after year. I find it impossible to believe they are unaware of this issue, yet unless it's addressed in the 2017 bike, they just seem to ignore the problem. I think we would be better off if BMW just removed the Bluetooth from the bike, and gave us a few 3.5mm jacks instead. That would have to reduce price as well, and stop owners from spending a 1000.00 dollars on magical helmets and bluetooth receivers that might work.
 
#45 ·
Now converted my third K16. Bagger this time.
I have made my own connection cable to the high pass to low pass filter (Sena SM10 is conneted to the filter) so no soldering is required. Works very well.
Best mod ever.
 

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